64 LeMans

[Andy H]

So i figured i start a tread about the progress on our car and start adding as we go.

We bought this 64 LeMans from a coworker that had it sitting in his backyard for 20 years, his dad bought it from the original owner.

The engine was rebuilt 20years ago, newer started and sat with out intake or spark plugs.

When i initially looked at the car i thought it was to rough and needed to much work but the more i thought about it i just could not let it slip away.

 

[Ringo64]

Nice! What are the plans for it?

[Andy H]

Hopefully it will be a nice driver i will post some more pictures when I get a chance.we have torn it down quite a bit by now.

 

 

[Frosty]

Obviously the motor work is in progress, based on your other thread.

What are your current plans for the car, given enough time and money? Just looking at these pictures I know a couple of things I'd like to do to it once the motor work is complete - if this was my car.

[64 kiwi boni]

Very cool car Andy, i look forward to you posting your progress, i have a good mate with the same model and they are a sexy looking shape

whats the body like?, the interior looks pretty tidy👍

[JUSTA6]

Looks like the perfect project car.  

[Andy H]

A couple of more pictures today.

We started by pulling the engine and trans, put it up in the engine stand and pulled the heads and pan, OMG a total loss, everything way rusty, barley got the pistons out of it and they where brand new when parked.

A coworker overheard that i was looking for an engine and told me he had a leftover 350 with th350 trans takeout engine for free, just come and pick it up so i did.

Got the engine home pulled it apart and it is looking like it was a cheap auto parts store engine, it was 030 over, crank 020 020 and the heads where a mess, one replaced seat, had both positive style seals and also o rings on top,used the wrong valve looks, they where to long and covered the second grove from the top on the valves, the one that is supposed to hold the o ring and they are about 90cc so very low compression.

Block of to machine shop and one cyl needed a sleeve and they bored it to 040, crank got polished other wise OK, bought some other heads in the mid 70's cc range to get the compression up a bit.

going to tap the front oil galley plug holes this weekend if i get time then cleanup time and put back together.

 

Plans for car? turn it in to a nice driver with A/C and hopefully a overdrive trans eventually so you can take some longer trips in comfort, have had cars in the past that i have added over drive trans to and it is so nice to cruise down the highway at 75mph and turning less then 2000rpm.

This car can be used like a family car and the kids could probably take it out on their own eventually unlike my 32 coupe with 489 and 5spd ( not finished yet)

Don't want to take it apart to much at a time, have sen to many cars totally taken apart and then the owner overwhelmed and the car never getting finished.

want the car to become drive able and work out the bugs first and then working on getting it painted.

The two last pictures are from the heads that came on the 350, any body got any idea what they are? could not make any sense of it, look like NO17 and casting date probably 1970 and the chamber size are almost 90cc?  Any ideas? not that it really matters, just curious.

 

More another day when i get a chance

 

 

[Frosty]

Hmmmm....interesting. A #17 head is definitely for a 350 engine - just from 1968.

 

 

Here are all the heads from 1970.

 

Other considerations for the future as you have time and money. I am sure you have probably thought of these things:

I know you have a 350 TH. At some point, perhaps you might consider a 200 4R overdrive transmission instead. It has the BOP bolt pattern and only a slight longer tail shaft, or perhaps a Gear Vendors Overdrive.

Consider replacing all your suspension bushing, ball joints, and body mounts. It will definitely firm up your ride.

Consider converting to front disc brakes and replacing the single pot master cylinder to a dual reservoir master cylinder.

 

BTW - you have a wonderful cruiser on your hands. It will be a fun car both to work on and to drive. Good luck with it.

[Andy H]

Frosty. And it's listed as 9.2 compression no way with high 80s cc

 

[Andy H]

Frosty. A lot of the things you mentioned are in progress and other will come later, please keep the ideas coming.

When I get a chance I'll update som more

[Frosty]

6 hours ago, Andy H said:

Frosty. And it's listed as 9.2 compression no way with high 80s cc

 

While I would agree with you, a lot of this material is based on published Pontiac material of the day. So like horsepower rating of the day, 330 HP was probably more 360-380 in some cases. So take compression ratios with some grain of salt.

Since you said keep the ideas coming, I will:

1. Install a rear sway bar if you don't have one. You may need to replace your rear lower control arms or box them though in order to do it.

2. Upgrade your power steering box to a quick(er) ratio one. Original ones are about 24:1 (about 4.5 turns lock to lock).  you can get affordable ones that are 16:1 or 12:1 these days. For my '72, I used a replacement steering box from an '86 IROC Z28 for Autozone for $128 (back in 2006) and it was 16:1. It is externally the same as the original and the car handles a lot better.

3. Add positraction if you have an open diff.

4. I am currently in the process of upgrading my car to all LED bulbs including the headlights. The headlights look like stock T3 hi and low beams.

5. Install a Pertronix III breakerless ignition kit to replace the points and condenser in your distributor

6. Replace all rubber fuel and vacuum lines with fresh modern rubber hose - front to back. This is a safety issue. Original hose was not designed to withstand today's modern gas with ethanol in it. Time, dirt, UV rays, and chemicals like motor oil work to break down hose from the outside. Ethanol will work to deteriorate old hose from the inside out. Today's modern hose is formulated to withstand ethanol. Judged shows do not deduct points on cars with modern hose because it now recognized as a safety issue.

 

 

[Andy H]

On 2/12/2021 at 1:15 PM, Frosty said:

While I would agree with you, a lot of this material is based on published Pontiac material of the day. So like horsepower rating of the day, 330 HP was probably more 360-380 in some cases. So take compression ratios with some grain of salt.

Since you said keep the ideas coming, I will:

1. Install a rear sway bar if you don't have one. You may need to replace your rear lower control arms or box them though in order to do it.

2. Upgrade your power steering box to a quick(er) ratio one. Original ones are about 24:1 (about 4.5 turns lock to lock).  you can get affordable ones that are 16:1 or 12:1 these days. For my '72, I used a replacement steering box from an '86 IROC Z28 for Autozone for $128 (back in 2006) and it was 16:1. It is externally the same as the original and the car handles a lot better.

3. Add positraction if you have an open diff.

4. I am currently in the process of upgrading my car to all LED bulbs including the headlights. The headlights look like stock T3 hi and low beams.

5. Install a Pertronix III breakerless ignition kit to replace the points and condenser in your distributor

6. Replace all rubber fuel and vacuum lines with fresh modern rubber hose - front to back. This is a safety issue. Original hose was not designed to withstand today's modern gas with ethanol in it. Time, dirt, UV rays, and chemicals like motor oil work to break down hose from the outside. Ethanol will work to deteriorate old hose from the inside out. Today's modern hose is formulated to withstand ethanol. Judged shows do not deduct points on cars with modern hose because it now recognized as a safety issue.

 

 

Good stuff, some of this will happen now and some is going to have to wait until we get it running.

The steering box i have thought about before but what is your experience as far as feel? if i'm not mistaken around town these cars are not to bad but on the highway they tend to have to much P/S. Also did not know what the original box ratio is so i did not have anything to compare with.

Just put LED bulbs in my wife's car the other week so yeas that is a easy one.

I don't have a distributor so that is the one i had in mind, which they had a as cast instead of the shiny one, have one in my 32.

Actually a friend of mine work for the exhaust side of Petronix, think they have Doug's headers an a couple of more brands.

All the rubber is going to be replaced for sure, most of it is gone anyway.

Got a little busy with family stuff but i will put up more pics when i get a chance.

 

[Andy H]

A couple more pics, this is kind of where it is right now got most of the front suspension painted, cleaned and blasted the spindles and the control arms, installed new bushings and ball joints. it will also get all new steering linkages and body bushings eventually but they are on back order until April 😒 A lot of surface rust but no holes, only had to cut one lower bolt off for a fender everything else just unbolted with some lube. Nice with a CA car.

Made a tub with water and citric acid and dipped a few parts and it works great. some stuff i brought to work and ran them in the big machine washing machine and some got bead blasted, i think i will have the inner fenders and core support powder coated that way i don't have to deal with those.

After removing the evaporator and heater fan housing on the firewall i realized that the heater box on the inside is sandwiched with the pieces that i removed and the firewall so now is the time to remove the inside heater box also to replace all the seals and make sure everything works, after removing the inside heater box we found some small rust holes in the floor on the passenger side but nothing else inside the car except for some surface rust around where the heater box was mounted so i started sanding it down and we will have to see if i can just weld the holes in the floor or if i have to cut some pieces out and replace.

Going to put disc brakes on the front,Had a long discussion with a friend of mine that builds cars for a living for a car collector and has tried a lot of the kits out there through the years oh yea he is pretty opinionated also 😁 after a lot of back and fort i found a kit at ABS power brake here in Orange CA that bolts right up to my stock spindles and uses calipers from a late 80s Cadillac and i am going to run manual brakes, got a brake master from a 72 Vega with a 3/4" bore and this is also something my friend had tried before so we will have to see how that works on this one. According to him he gets almost the same pedal effort with this as with a booster.

I am still fighting with the rear "hidden" oil galley plug that doesn't want to come out might have to take the block back up to the machine shop, would really like to get this one out so i can clean it properly before i put it back together.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[JUSTA6]

Thankz for the update, and pic's.  Nice job!

[Frosty]

Sounds like you are well on your away to a great street cruiser. I never thought of using a Vega master cylinder for a car that big before. I'm familiar with Vega master cylinders and steering boxes in hot rods like a '33 Ford, of course, but not on a 3600-4200 lb muscle car. I'm curious to see how you like it.

Great job. Great progress.

[64 kiwi boni]

Nice work Andy👍 isn't it nice when everything is clean and painted up

[Andy H]

9 hours ago, 64 kiwi boni said:

Nice work Andy👍 isn't it nice when everything is clean and painted up

Sure thing, just got to paint a few more things so i can start putting the front end back together, picked the brakes up yesterday.

There is parts everywhere, running out of space my garage i kind of small and my 32 is in there too.

[64 kiwi boni]

6 minutes ago, Andy H said:

Sure thing, just got to paint a few more things so i can start putting the front end back together, picked the brakes up yesterday.

There is parts everywhere, running out of space my garage i kind of small and my 32 is in there too.

Come on show us the 32 

 oh and by the way... a mans garage is NEVER big enough !!

[Andy H]

22 minutes ago, 64 kiwi boni said:

Come on show us the 32 

 oh and by the way... a mans garage is NEVER big enough !!

Not finished a Pontiac got in the way😁

[64 kiwi boni]

Super nice Andy, you have done a bloody great job,she is a 33? with those doors

and you have built her your self???

i love rat power toys, i ran a 454 in my 56 chevy  👍makes for a really fun car!!!, you will never have traction! hehehe 

i know the feeling about the car that gets in the road! i had my 64 pop up and i justA had to buy it, and since then i have been addicted to getting it on the road.

 Before the bonni came into my life, i was building this girl, she a hq holden 1972 but without the 186 engine, i am running  a fully balances and blue printed small block 400.with a whole bunch of goodies internally👍

(hopefully ringo will get the orientation issue fixed so we dont have upside down pics or side ways pics like this one )

Edited February 18, 2021 by 64 kiwi boni

[Andy H]

18 minutes ago, 64 kiwi boni said:

Super nice Andy, you have done a bloody great job,she is a 33? with those doors

and you have built her your self???

i love rat power toys, i ran a 454 in my 56 chevy  👍makes for a really fun car!!!, you will never have traction! hehehe 

i know the feeling about the car that gets in the road! i had my 64 pop up and i justA had to buy it, and since then i have been addicted to getting it on the road.

 Before the bonni came into my life, i was building this girl, she a hq holden 1972 but without the 186 engine, i am running  a fully balances and blue printed small block 400.with a whole bunch of goodies internally👍

(hopefully ringo will get the orientation issue fixed so we dont have upside down pics or side ways pics like this one )

You guys have all these really cool Holdens that never shoved up here in the US, what is a 186 engine? straight 4?

Mine is a 32 with a 489ci and tko 5spd, you got it will have no traction, so what😁 that is why the kids probably should not take it out so the Pontiac will work better.

[64 kiwi boni]

haha, nothing flash about the holden Andy, !! justA the fact that we had a gm built down under that was cool and looked a bit like a chev

the 186...https://www.carsguide.com.au/oversteer/the-red-motor-was-one-of-holdens-best-six-cylinder-engines-and-heres-why-66897

Your coupe looks like one hell of a lot of fun!! i bet you are enjoying building her

but i bet your gona get justA much fun out of your Lemans, they are a super cool body shape.

 Keep up the progress as their is lots of guys here who appreciate your time and effort that goes into these builds👍 

[64 kiwi boni]

13 hours ago, Andy H said:

Mine is a 32 with a 489ci and tko 5spd

Well Andy i justA learnt something! your 32 is the only body in 1932 that got the suicide doors being the Deluxe 3 window!! i thought all 32 had front hinged doors!  very cool mate 👍

[Andy H]

Shopping trip today down to OPGI , the body bushings came earlier than expected.

[JUSTA6]

Wow, glad I'm not that close to OPG.  Do they rent rooms too?   Nice haul.