1964 bonneville rebuild

[64 kiwi boni]

On 2/26/2021 at 11:45 AM, Last Indian said:

I hear ya! I’m really bummed because I JustA saw that Mr Potato Head is no more! Real! Now it Potato Head neutral gender! No kidding!

Latest News !!!! i justA hear on the radio that the company has done a u turn and Mr and Mrs Potato head will stay as is!!

aka common sense prevailed !!!

[Fitzy]

Because the sky is falling in here (pre cyclonic rain is set in all day, so I get to work on The Car) I had time to consider the Potato Head fiasco. Let me ask this:

If we all think the gender neutral decision was a joke, and if everyone we know feels the same, and their friends feel the same, how the hell do these ridiculous decisions get passed into law? What happened to democracy where the majority get to say what's what? How do a bunch of psychobabble goons get together and froth at their mouths and manage to get this sort of crap enacted? The same way that JustA's "cross dressing fags" get permission to use the ladies - the fringe dwelling minority jerks who have NOTHING in their lives are the ones making the rules? Really???

Oh...better stay on topic...New whitewall tyres: nothing flash, but will look nice once mounted on the Torqs. I was sure to buy tyres with the correct whitewall height. You know how whitewall height differed thru the years? Well, about an inch high is considered appropriate for the mid 60s. I took a pic of THIS tyre, because of the obvious scuff marks on the white portion. I scrubbed it with Autosol chrome polish and finished it with extra cut & polish. You're looking at it pre treatment - looks much better now.

[64 kiwi boni]

Dumb arse guide to buying points off rock auto, check what you have BEFORE you order them ! ahhaha

 so i had jumped on rock auto and ordered points for my stock 64 bonni dizzy, and didnt even look at what i had.. i assumed !! 

Bad move, attached is pictures.... the points i needed have the condenser attached! wtf, i am a Pontiac virgin 🙄... i am learning as i go along... ( and enjoying it too 👍) 

Edited March 3, 2021 by 64 kiwi boni

[Frosty]

Back in the day, the points and condenser were separate items and not physically attached to each other. You had to mount them and attach the lead from the condenser to the points.

Today, I don't bother with points, condenser, or dwell. I have a Pertronix Igniter II kit - it's now the Igniter III kit - in my stock OEM non-HEI distributor. No more physical points to wear out!

Here is Australian ad for one:  http://www.pertronix.com.au/ignitor3.html

 

[64 kiwi boni]

5 hours ago, Frosty said:

Back in the day, the points and condenser were separate items and not physically attached to each other. You had to mount them and attach the lead from the condenser to the points.

Today, I don't bother with points, condenser, or dwell. I have a Pertronix Igniter II kit - it's now the Igniter III kit - in my stock OEM non-HEI distributor. No more physical points to wear out!

Here is Australian ad for one:  http://www.pertronix.com.au/ignitor3.html

 

yes Frosty, that was an option, but i will add them or even a whole new distributor later once the car is on the road 👍 

[64 kiwi boni]

what do you guys think of this triple carb set up, is it worth thinking about for the 389 ?

https://www.trademe.co.nz/a/motors/car-parts-accessories/performance/carburation-induction/listing/3004279378?bof=gT3vCrOV

[Frosty]

It's definitely an awesome piece. A set-up like that can run close to $2k USD. So it's definitely Pontiac eye candy pure and simply. If you got the wallet for it, I'd say go for it. Just be prepared to justify your actions to the missus.

The biggest trick is keeping all three carbs properly tuned. Justa as tri-power set-up on his 421.

[JUSTA6]

5 hours ago, 64 kiwi boni said:

what do you guys think of this triple carb set up, is it worth thinking about for the 389 ?

https://www.trademe.co.nz/a/motors/car-parts-accessories/performance/carburation-induction/listing/3004279378?bof=gT3vCrOV

Say's the page can't be found both times I tried  to look at it.

8 minutes ago, Frosty said:

It's definitely an awesome piece. A set-up like that can run close to $2k USD. So it's definitely Pontiac eye candy pure and simply. If you got the wallet for it, I'd say go for it. Just be prepared to justify your actions to the missus.

The biggest trick is keeping all three carbs properly tuned. Justa as tri-power set-up on his 421.

[Frosty]

4 minutes ago, JUSTA6 said:

Say's the page can't be found both times I tried  to look at it.

It's a complete tri-power set-up for $950. Only thing that appears to be missing is it isn't painted Pontiac blue.

[64 kiwi boni]

JustA, see if this works...

Pontiac Triple carburators _ Trade Me Motors.html

5 hours ago, Frosty said:

It's definitely an awesome piece. A set-up like that can run close to $2k USD. So it's definitely Pontiac eye candy pure and simply. If you got the wallet for it, I'd say go for it. Just be prepared to justify your actions to the missus.

The biggest trick is keeping all three carbs properly tuned. Justa as tri-power set-up on his 421.

yes good point about the boss, i might justA dip my toe in the  water and see if it gets bitten off or not ! hahaha

[Frosty]

2 hours ago, 64 kiwi boni said:

JustA, see if this works...

Pontiac Triple carburators _ Trade Me Motors.html 633.76 kB · 1 download

yes good point about the boss, i might justA dip my toe in the  water and see if it gets bitten off or not ! hahaha

Totally worth the continued verbally abuse you'll end up getting. Since you're married, the only time you take your foot out of your mouth anyway is to swap leather, so this shouldn't be a problem.

Good luck mate! We're all cheering you on! 

[JUSTA6]

4 hours ago, 64 kiwi boni said:

JustA, see if this works...

Pontiac Triple carburators _ Trade Me Motors.html 633.76 kB · 1 download

yes good point about the boss, i might justA dip my toe in the  water and see if it gets bitten off or not ! hahaha

Yep. All there.  Vac lines for brake booster on linkage side.  PCV and distributor vac lines, and the choke tubes look ok on the other side.  Fuel lines are all intact too.  Whats missing is the trans bracket that allows you to hook up the trans kick down and throttle linkage.  I had a very hard time finding one.  Ended up using a throttle bracket and welding up what I needed for the trans.  Frosty is right, that set up would be around the $2000 mark here.  But as always, it's only worth what someone's willing to pay for it. Looks like only 1 bidder so the price war has not begun.  I would watch it and maybe bid at the end.   All that said....Been driving the GTO for may years and still can't work out the BOG when the outside carbs kick in.  Have tried everything.   I can feather it past the bog, but can't JUSTA stomp it to the floor.

[64 kiwi boni]

9 minutes ago, JUSTA6 said:

Yep. All there.  Vac lines for brake booster on linkage side.  PCV and distributor vac lines, and the choke tubes look ok on the other side.  Fuel lines are all intact too.  Whats missing is the trans bracket that allows you to hook up the trans kick down and throttle linkage.  I had a very hard time finding one.  Ended up using a throttle bracket and welding up what I needed for the trans.  Frosty is right, that set up would be around the $2000 mark here.  But as always, it's only worth what someone's willing to pay for it. Looks like only 1 bidder so the price war has not begun.  I would watch it and maybe bid at the end.   All that said....Been driving the GTO for may years and still can't work out the BOG when the outside carbs kick in.  Have tried everything.   I can feather it past the bog, but can't JUSTA stomp it to the floor.

Thanks justA 👍

I will ask about the bracket 

and yes ..... I have bit of a plan for my bidding 😎

frosty , the boss is on at me all the time 

mostly about why I am spending soo much time on the Bonnie, but I am about to gain some brownie points for doing a new shower for the daughter this weekend so that’s my window of opertuneity 😜

and having brownie points is over rated !! Way more fun burning  them as fast as you can hahaha 

[64 kiwi boni]

Justa, i wont buy this tri carb set up unless you can help me set it up.... is it worth it????

[64 kiwi boni]

i asked about the kick down bracket, and it was on a manual car so no bracket

[Fitzy]

23 hours ago, 64 kiwi boni said:

what do you guys think of this triple carb set up, is it worth thinking about for the 389 ?

https://www.trademe.co.nz/a/motors/car-parts-accessories/performance/carburation-induction/listing/3004279378?bof=gT3vCrOV

Kiwi, have a look at the Ames catalogue - downloadable if you don't already have it. There's an entire section devoted to tri power setups. Personally, I can't be arsed fiddling with multiple carbs - one is plenty. AND I think it was 1968 or thereabouts when GM made the decision to no longer offer them, having made more power with a Rochester albeit on a larger motor, but for sheer presence and as eye candy, they look shit hot.

For our American viewers, 'shit hot' means damn good.

[64 kiwi boni]

Yeah Fitzty, i justA like the idea of tri carbs, i would feel a lot better about it if i get some guidance on tuning them.

oh and i have the ames catalogue on my desk top... i will have a peek

[Fitzy]

I just found these, if it helps...

[Fitzy]

I had a twin carb VW Karmann Ghia many years ago (another car I should have kept) and a Uni-Syn was the device used to balance the carbs. Really, life is too short to be bent under the hood fiddling & swearing with the intricate linkages and multiple adjustments to get the thing to run right. 

I insisted on lowering my car and will put up with it's shortcomings, so you go your own way. Good luck! 

[JUSTA6]

8 hours ago, Fitzy said:

I just found these, if it helps...

OMG.. This is great.   Check out what he is using for the throttle cable bracket.  A plug wire loom. 

That fuel line plumbing is NOT factory and completely F'd up.  Good way to burn down your pride N joy.  The themostate housing appears wrong as well, facing the wrong direction.  Most Pontiac have upper hose to the right side of the radiator.  RUN, don't walk away from this one esp at that price.

Edited March 9, 2021 by JUSTA6

[JUSTA6]

10 hours ago, 64 kiwi boni said:

Justa, i wont buy this tri carb set up unless you can help me set it up.... is it worth it????

This is NOT rocket science and should NOT be intimidating.  It's 3 Rochester 2 barrels.  As basic as it gets.  The entire system runs off the middle carb.  This has the normal adjusting screws.  Be it right or wrong, I was always taught working with my Dad N Grandpa the best way to tune a carb is to hook up a vacume gauge and adjust the carb to the highest vacume you can make.  Start with the left side adjusting screw. All the way in.  Back it out 1 1/2 turns.  Now go out until the engine revs higher and vac raises.  Might have to go in to raise RPMs N vacume.  Now follow same instructions on the right adjusting screw. Finish with idle RPM screw to usually 800 RPM.  Some adjust idle with an automatic trans in gear.  I always adjust in park/neutral.  When in gear RPM will then drop to 6-700RPM at idle.   Your now adjusted to run the car on the middle 2 barrel from idle to full throttle.

Now, wanna give er a kick?   Let add 2 more carbs.  These are non adjustable. They don't have adjustment screws.  I'm sure you could re-jet, but why? Bigger cam, higher compression might be the only reason. It's set up to run like a 4 bbl, past 1/2 throttle they kick in depending on where adjusted. Just like changing the spring rate in a 4bbl.   Look at the pic's from the setup your lookin to buy Kiwi.  Throttle linkage for outside carbs is on the choke side with a solid connecting rod.  You open the butterflies wide open and bend the rod up or down til both carbs open exactly the same.  Never need to mess with this again.  Now open full throttle and make sure your getting gas from both outside carbs as you would with a normal 4 bbl.  They both have normal floats, experience normal carb probs with floats sticking open or closed.  If your smoking out the exhaust, check to see if one or both outside carbs are leaking/dumping gas before they are suppose to kick in.  The tri power set up is top of the line cool and you paid extra for it back in the day.  Alot of flash and intimidation for those that are unfamiliar with multiple carbs.  There is no constant adjusting to keep them in sinc like alot of multiple carb setups.  At what RPM do you want them to kick in is the biggest decision you have to make.  EYE CANDY like the rest of hard to find option makes your car that much cooler.  Up to you.  I added the console and HIS/HERS shifter to my 66 because I've always thought it was sooo damn cool.  It didn't come out in the GTO til 67 for the purest.  These are the same people that can read your Vin plate and know what everything means.  They walk away shakin their heads that the car didn't come with Tri Power. Much respect to these guys, but Cmon.

Now....Why can't I figure out the bog in my own damn car?

[JUSTA6]

9 hours ago, 64 kiwi boni said:

i asked about the kick down bracket, and it was on a manual car so no bracket

Still need to hook up your throttle cable, but you could use the one off your intake.  Appears to be factory air cleaners.  These are very expensive.  I have cheap ones that came with my motor.  I would check these out further.  Looks like you have a good setup there to bid on buddy!

[64 kiwi boni]

2 hours ago, JUSTA6 said:

Still need to hook up your throttle cable, but you could use the one off your intake.  Appears to be factory air cleaners.  These are very expensive.  I have cheap ones that came with my motor.  I would check these out further.  Looks like you have a good setup there to bid on buddy!

hmm, you make me feel a way lot better about the tri carbs,,, and hay you only live once !! so bugger it i am going for it 

[Fitzy]

I liked JustA's comments. He's right, of course but I get uncomfortable when I see extra bits & pieces in an engine bay that could be done without.

JustA, re your 'bogging' problem. I'm imagining that when you floor the go pedal, all your engine vacuum goes to lunch, so all of a sudden there's plenty of fuel getting dumped in your engine but perhaps insufficient air until the engine gets some revs up to compensate for all the raw fuel. Does the tri power setup have additional vacuum componentry to alleviate this? Is there an effect on your ignition timing that might not be helping? 

On a past car of mine, once upon a time every time I needed extra power the engine would splutter and falter until I backed off the throttle pedal and it would run fine. I pulled that carby apart many times trying to find what was going on. It was faulty points and/or condenser. Once replaced, no more issues. Just something for you to consider, but I'm sure you've tried everything and are now at the 3am laying awake in bed stage trying to figure out what's going on in your engine.

[Fitzy]

Can someone educate me on what a His & Hers shifter is? I know Frosty & JustA have them installed but I'm intrigued. Surely, allowing the missus to shift gears is playing Russian roulette with your car!