Wrongway

So I was able to find all kinds of info on the red oxide primer where I couldn't when searching for red undercoating. Thanks again Sprint, here's a couple pics of what it looked like. There's a fella that said he doesn't think anybody makes it anymore but has got a recipe in a post I found, for a paint, not a primer that looks really super close for those restoring there car and didn't want to use just a primer.

That sounds more like what he was talking about Sprint since he was calling it undercoating. Interesting to think about why somebody would opt out of undercoating though.

Ok, that's cool. Thanks, cant say I remember ever seeing any but I'll be on the look out now

I totally agree C-lane and there will always be a spot in my heart for an old FE engine lol. Thanks for the info Rocket, I'll have to take a look.

Hey welcome bro. I'm a Ford guy building my 1st Pontiac to. I did mostly F100 builds and a couple mustangs. These Pontiacs are a trip man. Have fun with it bro and these guys here are super knowledgeable and great group of people.

Hey Paul, that number doesn't show up on the list of block numbers that I have. Not saying that one of the others guys cant run that one. On my 68 engine the block numbers are located on the top, back of the block right behind the passenger side head and the date code is by the oil plug on the distributor pad. That's a 68-69 400ci

Thanks Trip. That may very well be what he was referring to when he was talking about his frame. Maybe he thought everything was that color then. I just hadn't heard or seen anything other than black undercoating and it kinda peaked my interest so I thought id mention it. So those were an option, but why? Were they lighter or more of a vanity thing? Hmmmm that ebay link says they are plastic liners. Interesting

So within the last week or so I read a post or a for sale ad, may have even been something on this site but I honestly don't remember. With all my charging issues at the time I didn't pay it much attention, but its been chewing away at the back of my brain. This fella made reference to the "original red Pontiac undercoat." Does anybody know what years Pontiac used a red undercoating? I've looked online unsuccessfully. Did they actually do this and did Buick, Olds or anybody else use any color other than black for their undercoating?

Hey Lew, something else to think about is that you will shoot a car differently then I will even with the same color. That's just how it goes. Even if we both spay 3 coats, you may walk your line a bit faster or slower then I do meaning yours will be a shade lighter or darker more then likely. Anytime I paint a car I personally always have a sample mixed up that I can shoot and play with. That way I can see how the color lays out and which way looks the best.

Man I remember when it seemed like at least 1 out off every 3 people you talked to worked for some facet of the auto industry, including myself, step dad and almost all of my uncles, cousins and brother in laws. Its just crazy to look back and think how 1 industry can shape and build a city and community's. Then tear down what everybody worked so hard to build, leaving those city's in ruins, destroying lives, ripping a part family's and leaving such uncertainly in its place. I truly hope everything works out for them bro.

Welcome Lew

Amen brother, well said. Sorry to hear about your friends. It really is a damn shame.

Great, man that makes me happy lol. I was hoping that you'd say it was supposed to be hot. My only concern WAS it draining the battery. Thanks for everything, I really appreciate all the help bro.

Ok so I replaced the regulator and still only had 12V at the alternator. I DID NOT have a wire in terminal 3. I couldn't find one loose or laying around either so I connected a jumper wire from the #4 terminal which is 12V keyed and connected it to the #3 terminal. The blue wire F terminal is now hot when the key is switched on as it should be. But I still only had 12V at the alternator. Once I moved the blue wire (F on regulator) at the R terminal to the F terminal on the back of the alternator she got excited. I checked it again and 14.5V at back of the alternator! I'll post pics to help explain everything. So now my only question is, why when the key is off and I check the voltage at the back of the alternator is it hot? I would assume that with the key off and putting the red probe on the positive on the back of the alternator and grounding the black probe to the alternator case or the battery that my multimeter should read 00.0 instead of the same voltage as my battery which at the time of the test was 12.9. (My volt gauge in the car does show 0)

Great pic bro, so I'll hook the F to F tomorrow after I get the new regulator. My car does have a factory radio so I'll keep terminal 4 hooked up, but I don't remember anything hooked up to terminals 2 or 3 so I'll double check that also and then retest and let you know.

Its an external voltage regulator bro. I called the alternator manufactures tech line and ran a bunch of tests. I think you're on the right track with the regulator bro. I don't think that the alternator is getting excited. The plug on my regulator is marked F 2 3 4 indicating each terminal. Terminal 4 has power but terminal F does not. The tech said that both should be hot. It looks like the blue wire at terminal F on the regulator goes to the R terminal on the back of the alternator and nothing is plugged into the F terminal on the alternator. I asked the tech if that was connected correctly and he didn't know. Seems to me that the F terminal on the regulator should plug into the F terminal on the alternator, but I don't know that may be too logical lol. The voltage regulator is still under warranty so I had the parts house order me another one and it'll be here tomorrow, figured it couldn't hurt. Any idea what plugs into the R and F terminal on the back of the alternator?

Ok, so new alternator is on and with car started its still showing 12V at the back of the alternator. That's 2 new alternators that were showing about the same. Could it really be 2 defective alternators or could it be something else like the 55 year old wiring?

Interesting. I've always liked the fiero and have thought about building one over the years. You see a lot of SBC swaps but I always thought a tri-power 389 would be really cool. Maybe one day, since they're going to "stay affordable". Thanks Hagerty 😁

Thanks guys, I really do appreciate all the help. OK so here we go, Battery cables are good and new, replaced them yesterday but I did double check them. With the car off the battery shows 12.2V Negative cable disconnected, one end of 12v tester clipped to negative terminal and the other end touching the negative post. Tester did not light up. Battery while cranking 11.5V Alternator while running 12.1V Battery while running was 12.1V The fuse behind the alternator is a 2.0 and showed to be good. BUT oddly enough it was covered in what looked like used motor oil. Not like just a smear but when I touched it I had drops on my finger. Would love an explanation on how that could've happened? So I went and exchanged the alternator tonight since it was less then 3 weeks old. I will install it tomorrow weather permitting.

Thanks Black top, ill do all of those test tomorrow and let y'all know the result's. Its to late right now to start it up, its a bit loud lol. Be glad to get the exhaust ran.

Thanks frosty, I did replace the positive while at his shop and when I was taking it off I found a spot where the installation was melted and about a half inch of bare wire was showing. Thought that was the issue but when I got home it wouldn't restart. I believe you're correct and that was why it died to begin with though and it did make it home without dying again. Not sure as to why it wouldn't restart after I got home though. Any thoughts on that?

Ok so I'm working out the bugs in the 428 I just built. Iv ran into a couple issues and would like to know your thoughts and advice. So I'm driving to a buddy's shop yesterday to use his lift to check out my pans and frame before I start tearing down for body work and paint. He about 10mi from me. I get about half way there, pull up to a red light, light turns green and I step on the gas. Car dies. Doesn't shake, doesn't spit or cough, just dies like somebody unplugged it. I try to restart and the motor turns really slow. This has happened before on around the block trips but I thought I had solved the problem. So I push it off the road and it still wouldn't start. I figured typical Pontiac, big engine with headers and heat soaked starter. So im sitting there letting it cool after only driving 4-5mi. My buddy's on the way and she starts. So I pull into Kroger's parking lot to wait for him to follow me and shut the car off so the starter to cool a bit more. He shows up maybe 5min later and again, no start. But it jumped right off! So we get to the shop where we were going and I pull right in and onto the rack. I shut the car off and tried to start it back up. Engine turns slow. We noticed the positive battery cable was hot and jumped when you turned the key. I replaced it with a 2ga and restarted it. It DID start up, but the starter was cold at the time. I let the car run for a few min while sayin thank you and good bye. I started backing up and my buddy who's shop said something and figuring the problem was fixed I shut the car off. (Cant hear over open headers). Anyways the car would not start. Thinking the starter was hot again, getting frustrated and looking up mini starters my buddy puts a jump box on my battery and turns the key. Fires right up. WTF, I get in and shut it of. Starts right up. I shut it off 4 or 5 times and she jumps to life each time. No slow starts jump boom right there. So, with all this said, before this happened yesterday and while trying to solve this problem I had replaced the alternator, voltage regulator, new battery twice. My autometer volt gage shows almost 12 volts when the engine is running. My thoughts are that there may be a broken wire in the charging circuits somewhere. Iv looked but didn't see any. What's your thoughts? Also if I remember correctly I should be able to connect a jumper wire from the Bat+ terminal on the back off the alternator to the positive post on the battery and by pass everything to make it charge, correct? Btw when I got home and shut the car off, it wouldn't start.

Sure thing, hope it works

It looks like Dorman makes one but it didn't say if it was for carb or F.I. The advanced auto part # is E2005419181DOR