REQUEST: Assistance in getting dash brake light to work

[Darth Menace]

Hello, I am onto my last project until I am able to get this car on the road, barring any other issues that may pop up. I am completely stuck on this one and am reaching out to see if anyone has any further suggestions.

When I press the e-brake, the light on the dash does not light up...this is a no no when it comes to the provincial inspection.

A few days ago I took a quick peek to see if I could find the issue. The test light showed that I was getting power to the tan wire, but nothing past that. I fiddled with the e-brake switch and it kind of crumbled in my hands. This made me happy, because I thought there was no way that the brake switch wasn't the issue. I bought a new brake switch and replaced it, but nothing changed.

Now I just want to clarify that the brake light on the dash did light up when I first had the car...this was because there was issues with the brake system. Today I checked the bulb with the rear side marker socket and it worked fine...so the bulb is not the issue.

From what I understand the ignition has to be in the on position for it to be able to work. Like I mentioned when I first started ti play with this issue, I was getting power to the tan wire. Now today, when I played around with it, I am no longer getting power to the tan wire. I assume this tan wire is the wire that comes out and plugs into the brake's junction box (if that is what the correct term is), but this wire is black on my car...I am thinking it is because of paint that was put on it back in the day. If this is the wire, I did make sure that the wire was tightly plugged into the junction box.

I looked in the pontiac repair manual I have, and I cannot see where they touch on how this e-brake light system works and how to troubleshoot it.

Am I missing something here? It is likely an easy fix as it doesn't seem like there is a lot to this, but changing the brake switch didn't solve it like I thought it would. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

[Frosty]

So you want to insure that the brake instrument (a.k.a. "idiot") light comes on when you depress the emergency brake pedal with the ignition on? Correct? Currently it does not work and it needs to work to pass state/provincial licensing registration and/or inspection. Did I miss anything?

[Darth Menace]

No, that is correct. The brake light does not come on when the e-brake is pressed down. I have looked at everything I can think of, without fully understanding the e-brake system itself.

-I replaced the switch..

-The bulb works, and I have tried numerous bulbs that work

-Today I grounded the tan wire on the e-brake system and the wire that goes to the brake junction box. I was told this would likely make the light go on....but neither options worked.

I am completely stumped.

So you want to insure that the brake instrument (a.k.a. "idiot") light comes on when you depress the emergency brake pedal with the ignition on? Correct? Currently it does not work and it needs to work to pass state/provincial licensing registration and/or inspection. Did I miss anything?

[Frosty]

Alright, I have a couple of possibilities for you to check. I have marked up a page from the 70-71 electrical diagram manual. It should be virtually the same for your '69.

The parking brake switch is a 20 gauge tan wire that runs to the bulkhead connector and then ties into the cluster wiring harness into the back of the instrument panel.

1. Test the tan wire from the bulkhead connector to the I/P connector to see if it is broken.

2. Check to see if the I/P circuit panel from the I/P connector to the bulb is broken.

3. Check to see if there is power coming from the fuse from the 12 gauge Orange wiring going to the fuse panel (opposite half of the bulkhead connector or if the 12 gauge wire is broken.

[Darth Menace]

Thanks for the info. That sheet is pretty much bang on from the one in my 69 repair manual. It is knowledgeable people like you that have helped the rookies like me actually make progress on this car.

I will give these things a test, but I know I am missing something. I believe it is safe to assume that it is not the circuit board considering this worked not long ago when I had a bad braking system. I don't know though obviously so I will do all these tests and get back to you.

I know I am not getting any power at the tan wire where it plugs into the brake switch.

One last note...if it is the circuit, is there a way to run a wire directly to the bulb in the cluster?

Alright, I have a couple of possibilities for you to check. I have marked up a page from the 70-71 electrical diagram manual. It should be virtually the same for your '69.

The parking brake switch is a 20 gauge tan wire that runs to the bulkhead connector and then ties into the cluster wiring harness into the back of the instrument panel.

1. Test the tan wire from the bulkhead connector to the I/P connector to see if it is broken.

2. Check to see if the I/P circuit panel from the I/P connector to the bulb is broken.

3. Check to see if there is power coming from the fuse from the 12 gauge Orange wiring going to the fuse panel (opposite half of the bulkhead connector or if the 12 gauge wire is broken.

70-71_GTO_page3.JPG

[Darth Menace]

Frosty, I got it working, Turns out it was a bad socket..the second I swapped it it lit up. Thanks so much for your help. Your write-ups and documents are very in depth and I thank you so much for helping me with this

[Frosty]

That is great news Darth !!!!

Sometimes it is the little things. Now get that thing back on the road and enjoy it, and post some pictures when you do !!!

[Darth Menace]

Ya, this is truly great news. I have never had an issue end up being the little thing, so I am super happy that this was the case. I had tried everything except for that so i did it in desperation.

The car should be on the road in May at the latest, but I will see how soon the tune can get done then I just have to get the wheel well back on since I replaced the heater core.

I tend not to post pictures on forums too much of this car as it is a GTO clone and I don't like reading what some purists say about other people's clone cars so I don't want to read it about mine.

That is great news Darth !!!!

Sometimes it is the little things. Now get that thing back on the road and enjoy it, and post some pictures when you do !!!

[Frosty]

I can appreciate that. The purists tend to want to rule the roost. I understand their position. However, it is not mine. So long as everyone is forth right and honest, there is no problem in my book. The only issue I have with clones are those unscrupulous types that build clones to sell to unwary buyers, passing them off as the real thing, strictly for profit. You are not in the club by a long shot.

Post as you see fit my friend.

[Darth Menace]

I am in the same mind-set as you. I don't appreciate being ripped off, or anyone else for that matter. But I have gone to many a car show where I looked at a car and wanted to puke in my mouth, but wouldn't dream of telling that person. I have yet to understand how a clone is complete garbage yet the real thing is the greatest thing since sliced bread. Sure, the one is worth more and original, but that that doesn't make them complete opposite ends of the spectrum. Anyway, sorry for my off topic. Once I get the car out and inspected I will get some pictures alone and with my Viper. I am so excited to take my family out for a cruise in this beast.

Thanks again for the help.

I can appreciate that. The purists tend to want to rule the roost. I understand their position. However, it is not mine. So long as everyone is forth right and honest, there is no problem in my book. The only issue I have with clones are those unscrupulous types that build clones to sell to unwary buyers, passing them off as the real thing, strictly for profit. You are not in the club by a long shot.

Post as you see fit my friend.

[Frosty]

But I have gone to many a car show where I looked at a car and wanted to puke in my mouth, but wouldn't dream of telling that person. I have yet to understand how a clone is complete garbage yet the real thing is the greatest thing since sliced bread. Sure, the one is worth more and original, but that that doesn't make them complete opposite ends of the spectrum.

Thanks again for the help.

The answer is pure snobbery in my opinion. I've seen GTOs that look worse than Lucy win an award because they are GTOs, and I always regsiter Lucy as a Lemans, even though it looks like a GTO (it was built with all the same Endura front end parts as part of the Sport package, only thing it is missing is those three little letters). In fact, in '72 the GTO was back to being an option off the Lemans, so the difference in VIN #s in '72 is mute, they all start with 2x37

Still the GTO lingers in people's mind as Pontiac's "muscle car" and a Lemans/Tempest/Custom S/T-37 does not get the same respect, even though the are essentially the same car (similar argument can be made for the Firebird/Formula/Trans Am crowd). However, the other side of that coin is, we are not afraid to go out, drive, and enjoy our cars either. A properly restored GTO can soon become a trailer queen only car, and how much fun is that unless you are constantly expecting to win trophies with it. So driving a cloned goat will allow you the fun of driving a GTO without the real cost associated with trailer queen either.

[Mharris22]

Do you know where I can get a wiring diagram for the ignition switch on a 66 lemans?

[Frosty]

I would think JUSTA6 or SPRINT6 would be the best ones to answer this one. 

[JUSTA6]

On 5/18/2017 at 5:14 AM, Mharris22 said:

Do you know where I can get a wiring diagram for the ignition switch on a 66 lemans?

http://thepartguy.com/diagrams/gto-lemans/W - GTO LeMans 67 - Chassis Wiring Diagram (FRONT HALF).pdf

Hard to read, I bought mine through OPG  (original parts group)  https://www.opgi.com/lemans/1966                   Tried a picture of my page and it's Justas hard to read.

Edited May 19, 2017 by JUSTA6

[Mharris22]

Awesome thanks for the response, yea I actually ordered one from Ames performance yesterday having a shorting issue just need to know where all the power wires were. On another subject do you have any experience with convertible tops? I replaced the pump motor assembly and I was wondering if I need to bleed air out of the lines or if just by filling it with fluid it would bleed out itself, any help is appreciated 

[Frosty]

I am going thru this process myself with my '72 convertible as one of the lines blew out after 45 years.

You must bleed the lines. You can add transmission fluid once you've removed the little rubber stopper in the side of the motor case. I purchased a small ketchup bottle to make pouring the transmission fluid into the hole easier for me.

1. Fill the motor with oil until you can feel the oil just below the hole. 

2. Cycle the top up and down three or four times (this will force the air back to the motor and allow it to escape out the hole)

3. Repeat steps 1 & 2 until you don't need to add oil anymore

4. Insert the rubber plug

 

BTW - this is the process that was in my GM service manual. 

Edited May 24, 2017 by Frosty