1964 bonneville rebuild

[64 kiwi boni]

hi all, i bought this 64 Bonneville that has had a head on.

the guy i bought it off had collected all the front sheet metal to put it on the road again.

i had booked in with my panel shop guy to put the car on his chassis machine in mid February.

how ever he called out last night and inspected the frame.

he advises me to forget straightening it, just find a replacement.

which i think will be a much better long term option.

which brings me to my first question....

this is a 64 2 door hard top, what chassis could fit ?, i would expect a convertible one wont but what about a 4 door frame ? 

 and does anyone here possibly have one for sale?

[Frosty]

Hi 64 Kiwi Boni - Welcome to FP and the madness.

The 64 Bonneville/Catalina/2+2 have a wheel base of 123 inches/3124mm. This holds true for 2 door hardtop, 2 door convertible, 4 door hardtop and 4 door station wagon. Also the overall length of each vehicle is 220 inches/5588mm. So I am thinking that a 4-door chassis should also work. Clearly a 2 door chassis would be the most desirable.

Here are a handful of GM dismantlers / junk yards you can reach out to that may have a used chassis. Obviously if you have access to eBay, Criaglist, or Kijiji (Canada) - they are possible sources as well. Nothing is guaranteed but they are good places to start.

Desert Valley Auto Parts          https://www.dvap.com/

Frank's Pontiac Parts    https://www.frankspontiacparts.com/

GM Sports Salvage    http://gmsports.com/pontiac

Tom's Auto Parts  https://www.tomscarparts.com/

[64 kiwi boni]

Thanks frosty for the welcome and information, i have found a whole parts car just 3 hour drive from me here in nz  ! and what i need to find now is the specs and measurements for a 1964 pontiac bonneville chassis.

 any ideas were i can find this info ?....

once i get the frame i will post the whole jobbie of "changing a frame".... haha sounds easy!! NOT!!🤣

its going to take planning and a bit of cunning !.. i have a tractor, chains.... and need a winch..... 

i also need to pull the frame i have straight enought so that i can get the motor out 

so my first plan is to do a tree pull !!! 

 i live on what we call a life style block and i have 200 pine trees and 2 of them are going to be my anchors..   

watch this space! you may all have a laugh at my down under/back yard fix for what i think is a really cool car, i just hope my fergy 35 is up to the job...

[TWO LANE BLACK TOP]

I'm pretty sure that the 1963 and the 1964 Bonneville use the same frames...But NOT 100% sure....I don't have the 1964 Frame specs that you are looking for but I do have them for 1963 and 1965....I'm 95 % sure that 63 and 64 are the same...I will include the 1965 frame specs also....Pretty sure that the 65 is different from the 64 model...This may or may not be correct for 1964

Hope maybe these photos will help.....Hope they are legible....Welcome to the site

 

[64 kiwi boni]

that is exactly what i am after two lane !!! 

thanks heaps, my chassis is certainly like the 63 model and not the 65.

when i get the new frame i will compare the measurements.👍 

[Frosty]

On 1/30/2020 at 12:12 AM, 64 kiwi boni said:

Thanks frosty for the welcome and information, i have found a whole parts car just 3 hour drive from me here in nz  ! and what i need to find now is the specs and measurements for a 1964 pontiac bonneville chassis.

 any ideas were i can find this info ?....

once i get the frame i will post the whole jobbie of "changing a frame".... haha sounds easy!! NOT!!🤣

its going to take planning and a bit of cunning !.. i have a tractor, chains.... and need a winch..... 

i also need to pull the frame i have straight enought so that i can get the motor out 

so my first plan is to do a tree pull !!! 

 i live on what we call a life style block and i have 200 pine trees and 2 of them are going to be my anchors..   

watch this space! you may all have a laugh at my down under/back yard fix for what i think is a really cool car, i just hope my fergy 35 is up to the job...

Mate I can't wait to see what you have to go through. My buddy, JUSTA6, had to do a frame swap on his '66 GTO. I've heard his horror story. It will be interest to see what you discover along the way.

Kudos to Two Lane and his specs. Way to go buddy!

[JUSTA6]

23 hours ago, Frosty said:

Mate I can't wait to see what you have to go through. My buddy, JUSTA6, had to do a frame swap on his '66 GTO. I've heard his horror story. It will be interest to see what you discover along the way.

Kudos to Two Lane and his specs. Way to go buddy!

I can laugh about it now........ Shortly after claiming my prize frame.  A cement block exploded and the whole body crashed down, JUSTA missing me!!!!

[64 kiwi boni]

wow justa6 !! you were very lucky!! ... i have noted not to use cement blocks!👍

So Justa6, what issues did you have with pulling your chassis out ..... besides the faulty block!😊

 

 

Thanks to two lane,

i bought a copy of the 63 chassis manual from rockauto so  i can read up on what and were the mount points etc are to get too and all the measurements.👍

 

 

[JUSTA6]

4 hours ago, 64 kiwi boni said:

wow justa6 !! you were very lucky!! ... i have noted not to use cement blocks!👍

So Justa6, what issues did you have with pulling your chassis out ..... besides the faulty block?

 

 

 

None of it was easy.  Thursday night, the owner of the frame shop kicked the car out of his shop after a month of tinkering with the frame. I had completely replaced the entire suspension and couldn't come close to aligning the front tires, so it's off to the shop.   If it was not out of his place by Monday...a wrecker was haulin it to the junkyard.  He agreed to transfer my body to the new frame, (if I could get one AND have it to his shop Monday AM) Couple calls and the owner of the car agreed to help me out and sell the frame, IF I would help him strip the car of what he wanted.   Met the owner of the running/ driving Lemans @ 7am.  The two of us had the car completely stripped, engine/trans, front clip,  complete interior,  wiring, doors, side glass and  loaded on my car dolly by 1pm and heading home. Went to work bustin loose rusted body mounts. Of course the 1st one, with my feet on the frame and a 4 foot length of pipe.  Broke the bolt and the pipe of course opened a nice gash under my right eye.   Quick fix with duct tape and back at it.  After claiming my prize rolling frame, kept hearing this ping noise.   Down on one knee trying to pinpoint the noise when the block exploded. No time to move, launched myself backward's, landing on my back staring at the sky, with this body less than 3 ft from my legs.  The crash noise brought my wife/family and neighbors running to find me laying in the grass (sayin a quick thank you prayer)  Not thinking about the entire side of my face covered in blood from the gash under my eye.  Sending the entire situation to the next level.  Quickly jumping up to prove to everyone I was fine, then back to work.  Had to get the Lemans body back in the air, to get it on the trailer and out of my way.  Spent the next 2 days straight sanding preping, repairing rusted out body mounts, priming and painting.  Yes I was there @ 7:30am Monday waiting for the frame shop to open.  To this day he doesn't believe I pulled that one off.  The frame jig lets the body be separated and dropped on the new frame.   Smartass did not drop a couple bolts back in the body mounts and I almost lost the whole project getting it home, with the last mile+ being rough dirt roads!!!!!!   Stopped soooo many times moving the body around and finally got it home.   Now to rebuild the body front to trunk......WAIT thats a whole nother story.

[64 kiwi boni]

Ah now thats Grit!!👍

you did what you had to for the passion of your hobby!! Legend 🍻

good on you... and the frame shop guy will get his karma!! haha

[64 kiwi boni]

This afternoon  i  only got a few hours to make a start on my plan...

which is to get the bonnie steering with 4 wheels on the ground, and see if she will run...

remembering i bought the car as is were is, no warrenty ... zip... 

Once that part of the plan is sorted i will start striping off what i need to for the frame swap.

soo , here is what i got up to..

first i borrowed my good mates porta power, and it worked a treat..check the pictures

first push was parallel to the sill and it moved the frame about 4 inches forward, but i also bent one of the extensions doing it, so i will need to drop it off to my mate who can machine it straight again( hate breaking freinds tools)  

Once i had moved the 90 degree section forward enough i then set to try and push from that point out through the from A arm to the bumper mount, i dropped the front hub to give me clearance

[64 kiwi boni]

Then once i had that pushed forward, i moved the radiator support cross member forward off the fan

[64 kiwi boni]

And by now it was 5pm and i was pretty much done for the day..... but not quiet.

 now that i had moved everything off this motor i just had to give it a try and see if it would live !!😯

i hooked up a battery, and nothing!😖

so i pulled the ignition switch and found the contacts to the plug where corroded,,,, sand paper.. 

bang! she would light up the dash, and would turn over....👍

filled up the float bowl, and cranked.... nothing ...zip...

pulled the cap off, lots of spark at the points... sand papered the rotor....

bang!!! she started🍻😁

then i saw the oil!!!!

the filter had a puncher hole.

 so i shut her down....

clean up and call it a day. 

i was so pleased that she ran and now i can move forward to getting her mobile and can get her into the shed onto the hoist for the next stage.👍😊

[JUSTA6]

Fantastic progress.  Hearing it run, had to be a big relief.  

[TWO LANE BLACK TOP]

So far so good....Looks like you're off to a good start....

On 1/31/2020 at 2:31 AM, 64 kiwi boni said:

that is exactly what i am after two lane !!! 

thanks heaps, my chassis is certainly like the 63 model and not the 65.

when i get the new frame i will compare the measurements.👍 

Happy to help....

[64 kiwi boni]

hi Guys, i would like your input here.

i want to run the engine again, but i will change the oil and buggered oil filter..see attached what i have bought... thoughts????🙄

i think it will be ok, and i need to know what trans fluid to get, shes empty!! 

 we have a long weekend coming and i want to get the boni moving.... even if it just a few meters  

just for the hell of it 😋

[Frosty]

Hi kiwi boni,

The automatic transmission fluid (ATF) you want needs to be a DEXRON II or DEXRON III compatible ATF. You start getting into the more modern ATFs, and some shift quality problems are reported with older transmissions (e.g. unrestored/unrebuilt). You can also use a synthetic ATF or mix conventional and synthetic. However, my preference would be to use one or another.

Pontiac engines were designed with work best with 10W-30 or 10W-40 motor oil (according the late Pontiac historian John Sawruk). To get the engine running and moving under her own power and get through all the rebuild work you have in front of you, the 5W-40 is fine for now. I just would not continue to use it for the next 10,000 Km. Once you are ready to seriously drive the vehicle, I'd do another oil change.

I have no experience with the Ryco filters. I assume it is a Kiwi brand and it is the equivalent of the AC Delco PF-24 (OEM filter). Others North American brands are the Fram PH-25, WIX 51049, or Hastings LF212.

Good luck getting her started and moving. Keeps us posted!

[64 kiwi boni]

Thanks Frosty for the great info, i will get a drum of dexron👍

The plan is to get her to run and i have no idea how old the oil is in her so, i will use this just for the move to the shed and then , dump it.

 the sump has to come off as the front has a dent in it, which will need to be straightened.

While waiting for the new frame ,i have been starting the shopping, and today my rock auto order arrived( first one)😋... its always xmas when these arrive! and always a fridge magnet too 👍

I got a cover for the period of time she will have to be outside and as you can see engine mounts, brake hoses and the boot lock assembly, and power steer pump cap, that was missing

Rock auto have most of what i need, but i am still looking for the body mount kit, if anyone know were to look 

[Frosty]

Awesome start to the project.

Another thing I would strongly recommend as you go through the car is to replace all the rubber hoses in the car, especially those that come in contact with gas or gas vapor, and don't forget about the hose from the fuel tank the hard line(s). This includes your engine vacuum lines too.

The late John Sawruk, Pontiac Historian and Professional Engineer (PE), use to lecture us all the time about replacing old hose with new. The reason being that old (original) hose was not designed with today's modern ethanol blended fuels. So while time, UV, dirt, grim, and contamination work to destroy the rubber hose from the outside, ethanol fuels work to destroy the hose from the inside. Today's modern fuel hoses are designed to withstand ethanol fuels. Most judged shows do not deduct points for using modern hose either. It is now widely considered a safety issue. Now days you can order modern hose with the correct OEM markings on it too. It is just a smart thing to do.

Like I said about 5W-40 oil. Use it until the car is put back together and ready for regular use. So don't feel you have to dump it right away.

 

Edited February 5, 2020 by Frosty

[64 kiwi boni]

good advise Frosty, i will certainly be replacing all hoses 👍

i have made a extension pipe out of heat shrink about 1/8 and attached to my penetrating oil.

on the end i have plugged it and pin holed 4 holes so the fluid sparys 90 degrees to the hose 

i found that each of the chassis bolts is attached to a sub chassis section with small opening that i can get this small tube up into so i can spray the heck out of the caged nuts along each side of the car, in preparation for the removal job.

[64 kiwi boni]

And then i have pushed the whole front section out a bit more, the boni now has 4 wheels on the ground, brakes working, and she moves forward and backwards.

i have taken the radiator completely out and looped the trans cooler lines, topped u the trans too.

This is all in aid of the trip it will need to take which is all of about 20 steps to drive into the shed and onto the hoist.( no way i am going to push 1.8 ton 🤨)

but that wont happen till i get the replacement chassis, which may be another 2 weeks 

so i bought a good cover off rock auto and it fits really well 😋

[64 kiwi boni]

While i sit on my hands waiting for my replacement chassis, i have been trying to find suppliers for a trans mount( auto), a body mount replacement kit and a bush kit for the front and rear suspension.

anyone have recommendations on who are the best suppliers, rock auto dont have half of what i need.

And while i am at chassis level i will go with headers since these engines are clearly high compression and i bet if i add headers it will breath way better, so i need feed back on what brand will fit a 64 bonni correct ground clearance  

last car i just didn't do my home work on is my 72 rs camaro and i went though 3 sets of headers before i found good fitting shorty units that didnt throw sparks out the back over bump i went over 😡

so i really dont want to have to go down that path again, and the bonni is very low to start with, 

any info would be great 😄

[Frosty]

Well Original Parts Group come to mind. I think there are other OER catalogs that carry them too.

https://www.opgi.com/Search/body bushings.html

https://www.opgi.com/sheet-metal-body-panels/body-trunk-braces/steel-cage-nut-assembly/cage-nut-54-77-gm-complete-assembly-716-14-thread-c241477.html

Tranny mounts at Summit Racing

https://www.summitracing.com/search/part-type/transmission-mounts/year/1964/make/pontiac/model/bonneville

 

[64 kiwi boni]

Was really excited today, my bumper arrived that i bought of craiglist out of LA. its straight, has the irons and  the chrome isnt that flash so i am going to get it rapt unit till i can raise the coin to get it re chromed..

 i also traveled to up to Auckland to see my chassis and meet its owner, great bloke and the chassis is nice and straight... cant wait to get it and get the ball rolling... wife wants me to hold off spending money due to the covid-19 thing so that may slow things down for a little bit, but i beleave it will pass and life will go on 🙄🙄and i can get the debit card and go shopping at Ames and ogp

 👍🤑

i was hoping to plan a trip to hawaii for october and pop over to La and go see the ponitac guys at cpr in santa anna ( i know where it is as i have been to Danchucks a few times )

 but thats all out the window now...🙄

 

[Frosty]

Good to hear you are making progress. I am weather bound to work on my Lemans at the moment. No garage to work on her so I have to wait for warmer weather before I can. Partial progress is always better than perfect paralysis. Glad your parts from Cali were everything you hoped for.